i recall the idea that just like a jelly mould that has a dent all of the jellies will also be dented.
therefore just as adam was imperfect we to would have the imperfection.. if a cook makes a faulty jelly, is it the jelly that would be blamed?
no, it is the cook for using sub-standard tools or materials.. the same is true with adam, the faulty materials should have been replaced immediately, it is no good blaming the offspring of adam and making them pay for his faults.. i never could understand the suggestion that we had to pay for adams sin.
how can something bad come from something as good as God? how was Satan even able to think about anything bad if there was only good? to me, free will should have only been within the realm of good. you can choose from anything and everything, but since bad doesn't exist and CAN'T exist, then you can't choose it... that's what i try to wrap my Christian mind around. unfortunately, i dont get to speak to God, but i hope i'll be able to understand it one day.
newbethelyorklight
i've read that back in the day, rutherford worked the legal system to take over the wt society in opposition to russell's final instructions.
could this sort of thing ever happen again?
another recent thread on this forum spoke of there currently being factions within the organization that take opposing views of many things.
im not sure what autonomous means, but if it means that they operate separately from the society, it'll never ever happen. the only reason why witnesses are witnesses is because they HAVE the society. Jehovah's Witnessesism (TM) hinges on the fact that a faithful and discreet slave gives spiritual food at the proper time. without that, they are nothing. "WHERE WOULD THEY GO?" that's the question posed by every Jdub about people who think they dont need the society. Direction is everything to Jdubs, and if they receive no direction, they have nothing
new york bethel is falling
hello, i am intrested in the jehovah's witnesses and i was wondering if you guys could answer a few questions.
who do you beleive jesus is?
(fully believe)
i think there are many of us who, if people found out they were on a discussion board such as this, would be kicked out of the church, out of their homes and dissowned by anyone they care about who is a JW. after i read the bible (NIV), i couldnt accept 99% of the teachings that the JW's held. but i can't tell that to many people. i have too much to lose. i hate the fact that i have to keep quiet about my God, for fear of losing everything... and so do thousands of other witnesses who are trapped.
in a new york bethel minute
hello, i am intrested in the jehovah's witnesses and i was wondering if you guys could answer a few questions.
who do you beleive jesus is?
(fully believe)
thanks =) what i meant was the resurection of Jesus body
they believe that jesus was resurected, not bodily, but as a spirit. and when he returned in 1914, he returned invisibly.
bethelite
i didn't fade from the cult ,i just left so i don't know how fading work's.
do you attend meeting less offten ,do you attend a meeting then not go for a few weeks, then go back then stay away for a month etc.
if you fade to fast do you have to worry about the dredded talk with the elders?
that was a great find itsallgoodnow... that will help a lot of people.
i often picture myself getting cornered by an elder or two, and questioned about my beliefs.
my mother is a staunch witness, yet somehow she considers my doctrinal apostacy as research. which is weird but i guess im lucky. but let's say that she happened to mention that i questioned the belief that Jesus died on an upright pole to an elder in the hall. well here's where my picture of me getting cornered by elders comes in to play. i believe what i believe with no apologies. but in this one circumstance, i have vowed to swallow every last ounce of my pride in order to save everything that is important to me (my family and friends). all they really have to catch you up on is whether or not you believe that the FDS is the channel of communication that God is using to direct his chosen organization in this time of the end. if anyone who is baptized were to say no to that, it would be apostacy in the greatest sense, and that person would be disfellowshipped. SO ALWAYS SAY WHAT THEY WANT TO HEAR!!! you can always deny what you have said to friends and family about certain doubts. but you can't take it back if someone who has the power to have you shunned hears it.
SVETHEL
quote from the e-watchman's forum:
this "organization", whether or not it is in good standing in jehovah's eyes, has given us some very valuable and treasured accurate biblical knowledge.
to deny that would be unfair and perhaps throwing spiritual food back in our father's face ...
corvin im embarassed. i feel like a student lecturing a teacher!!! i didnt even look to see how many posts u have made! you're way ahead of me in the apostacy!
bethel
quote from the e-watchman's forum:
this "organization", whether or not it is in good standing in jehovah's eyes, has given us some very valuable and treasured accurate biblical knowledge.
to deny that would be unfair and perhaps throwing spiritual food back in our father's face ...
i liked your post corvin... im curious how long you've been out for... if you were ever to use reasoning like this with a Dub, you wouldn't get very far (unfortunately). they would use as many cliches as needed to make themselves feel like they are doing the right thing, and while they pat themselves on the back, they would not be without hope of swaying you back towards the "truth."
1) who else uses the name you seem to believe is God's name?
2) God has always had an organization, and the outsiders were always without his approval
3) When do you preach the good news? You can't do it effectively unless you do it strategically (door to door)
4) Jehovah forgave israel many many times and only until they killed his son did he disown them as a group, so if the Watchtower makes mistakes, we know Jehovah will forgive the FDS because at least they are trying, which is an act of repentance
5) There are no trick scales, but since haters of truth and opposers of God want to put the Watchtower in a bad light because of Satan's influence, the FDS sometimes has to skirt certain issues when correcting themselves, which is really an indirect way of apologising, and if that's not good enough for you, then maybe you should take to heart Jesus counsel of forgiveness, up to 77 times
6) Jesus has been here since 1914.
7) Jehovah's true Christian Witnesses is the only organization that doesnt go to war and always remains politically neutral, just as Jesus admonished Christians to do.
8) WHERE ELSE WILL YOU GO?
I personally dont believe any of these arguments. unfortunately many millions do. and they will repeat and re-repeat any or all of these expressions to make themselves feel better about their "faith." They think you will die at armageddon. They believe they are looking out for your best interests. They can't look past these points and will give you out-of-context scriptures from a biased bible to prove it.
The reason i asked you how long you've been out is because i felt the same way you did when i was fresh on the Apostate scene. Then i read the bible. A REAL BIBLE. I took some advice and bought what is considered one of, if not, the most trusted and accurate bibles available. I actually went to chapters and bought a New International Version bible and it made me believe something i thought i would and could never believe. And it was nothing like the Watchtower's Gospel. Part of the advice i was given was to start in Matthew. I read the new testament in about 3 or 4 months and it was very refreshing. I still dont know the answers to everything, but what i do know is that, what was lacking before, a connection with Jesus and a deeper understanding of his role and position, is now there. And to me that's a start towards being more spiritual. I was a witness for 24 years and never once felt spiritual. Now, sometimes i do. Im not better or worse, i just feel good about God sometimes. And that's important to me.
I hope none of this sounded preachy, but i honestly never thought i'd feel the way i do about God and Jesus, and the only thing that helped me was reading a real bible.
EL Beth HOLE
a bit of fluff, .
i have the fanta orange tune & pic.
i think i'm in need of an update, my mobile is a nokia and is 2 years old.
baby got back
money?,,,,,,, no, religion!
all the wars that i have studied have been attributed to religious beliefs who's foundation whereby being unfounded and un-provable.
trust in gawd, allah, jesus, jehovah, mohammed and on and on is what the lost say, or "the lord will provide" for that matter.
im going to agree with Xena. you can have your religion and even your apathy... and not be harming anyone. but when you take it to the level where you become the judge of others, based on your beliefs, then you begin to hurt other people. personally, i am a JW-turned-Christian. but i have gay friends because i dont have any right to judge them. i also have muslim friends. and yes, i even have some Jdub() friends still. open your mind and your heart will follow.
NEWbetheLIGHT
please post in this thread.
i want to see the three weirdo presidents together in the same place at the same time.. so let's play mad libs.
you remember mad libs?
and what are u going to do with it leolaia? make a jumble? am i done my homework, waiting for it to be corrected? I CANT WAIT!!!
york street
